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| Thanks to Our Robot Overlords for scribing this week! | ||
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| The transcript for the call is now available here: | ||
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| https://w3c-ccg.github.io/meetings/2024-11-18-vc-education/ | ||
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| Full text of the discussion follows for W3C archival purposes. | ||
| Audio of the meeting is available at the following location: | ||
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| https://w3c-ccg.github.io/meetings/2024-11-18-vc-education/audio.ogg | ||
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| A video recording is also available at: | ||
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| https://meet.w3c-ccg.org/archives/w3c-ccg-weekly-2024-11-18.mp4 | ||
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| ---------------------------------------------------------------- | ||
| VC for Education Task Force Transcript for 2024-11-18 | ||
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| Agenda: | ||
| https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-vc-edu/2024Nov/0002.html | ||
| Organizer: | ||
| Kerri Lemoie, Simone Ravaioli, Dmitri Zagidulin | ||
| Scribe: | ||
| Our Robot Overlords | ||
| Present: | ||
| Dmitri Zagidulin, Andy Griebel, Ildiko Mazar, Mahesh Balan - | ||
| pocketcred.com, James Chartrand, TallTed // Ted Thibodeau | ||
| (he/him) (OpenLinkSw.com), David Ward, Sheela Kiiskila, Jim | ||
| Kelly, Nis Jespersen , Simone Ravaoli, Phil Barker, Federico | ||
| Giacanelli, Kerri Lemoie, Merul (AuvoDigital), Deb Everhart, Nate | ||
| Otto, TimG, Chandi, Jeff O - HumanOS, Kayode Ezike, Chandi | ||
| Cumaranatunge | ||
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| Our Robot Overlords are scribing. | ||
| Dmitri Zagidulin: Yeah there we go all right uh so these calls | ||
| are free and open to anyone you don't have to be a member of the | ||
| group uh to join the call however if you want to make any | ||
| substantive contribution to any of the specs this group works on | ||
| uh you must be a member of w3c and a member of the credentials | ||
| community group of which this is a task force so if you want to | ||
| make contributions and have them joined yet please reach out to | ||
| myself or to go or to Simone and uh we'll walk you through how to | ||
| join. | ||
| Dmitri Zagidulin: Uh let's see outbound under w3c and ccg code | ||
| of conduct uh we use jitsi chat to queue up for questions so uh | ||
| hit raise your hand and uh the bot will automatically add you to | ||
| the queue. | ||
| Dmitri Zagidulin: You can go from there. | ||
| Dmitri Zagidulin: First stop uh introductions and | ||
| reintroductions is anybody new to the call today or I haven't | ||
| introduced themselves in a while and wants to say hello to | ||
| everyone. | ||
| Dmitri Zagidulin: All right um. | ||
| Dmitri Zagidulin: Next topic are there any Community | ||
| announcements. | ||
| Dmitri Zagidulin: All right no announcements uh in that case let | ||
| us move on to our main topic today uh which is uh DCC team uh | ||
| James Chartrand. | ||
| Dmitri Zagidulin: Alex Agera myself mostly James are going to be | ||
| presenting on a couple of interrelated topics. | ||
| Dmitri Zagidulin: Uh specifically we want to talk about the | ||
| course of study extension to the open badges version 3. | ||
| Dmitri Zagidulin: Uh specification this is for diplomas right so | ||
| you have a major and you have a course of study how do we and I'm | ||
| currently there isn't um a flexible way to express that so how do | ||
| you how do you express it using open badges well it turns out | ||
| that open badges has an extension mechanism with that you can use | ||
| to add custom Fields like this uh fun fact krie lamoy was the 1 | ||
| who originally uh created the extension mechanism for the | ||
| original open badge specification uh it's changed uh since then | ||
| but the idea is the same so we're going to talk about how the | ||
| extension mechanism Works in general and. | ||
| Dmitri Zagidulin: Although it's not exactly an extension but | ||
| it's a related topic we're going to talk a little bit about um. | ||
| Dmitri Zagidulin: Ation localization and specifically | ||
| multi-language fields in open badges. | ||
| Dmitri Zagidulin: All right uh over to you uh before we get | ||
| started I see James is setting up James uh we can see your screen | ||
| nicely. | ||
| Dmitri Zagidulin: Uh does anybody have any questions before we | ||
| get started. | ||
| Dmitri Zagidulin: All right over to you James. | ||
| James Chartrand: Okay thanks Dmitri uh everyone can see my | ||
| screen share okay. | ||
| James Chartrand: Great so as Demetri said this is all about um | ||
| extending obd3 to support degree May uh minors and Majors so to | ||
| be able to in an obd3 not just say that this obd3 is 4 degree but | ||
| to list the minors and Majors that go along with it um so today I | ||
| I'm going to be getting into the code a little bit so into the | ||
| weeds a little bit um and I'm assuming yep. | ||
| Dmitri Zagidulin: 1 Second James we we uh may have lost your | ||
| screen share I'm not sure if it's just me or if anybody else uh | ||
| has lost it as well. | ||
| Dmitri Zagidulin: If you. | ||
| James Chartrand: Can you see it is it back. | ||
| <simone_ravaioli> it is there for me | ||
| Kerri Lemoie: Yeah I can see the slides James. | ||
| Dmitri Zagidulin: Okay yep uh all right so if anybody else like | ||
| myself uh faces this uh just refresh and you should be able to. | ||
| <kerri_lemoie> Open Badges haven't been used for degrees in the | ||
| past (as far as we know) so we're encountering these challenges. | ||
| As another example, right before OBv3 was final, we recommended | ||
| adding "name" to the identity object because degrees usually | ||
| contain a person's name whereas open badges typically use email | ||
| addresses or other identifiers. | ||
| <ildiko_mazar> Why is the cardinality of fieldOfStudy [0..1]? | ||
| https://credreg.net/ctdl/terms/Degree#Degree | ||
| <phil_barker> Degree major in CTDL | ||
| https://credreg.net/ctdl/terms/degreeMajor | ||
| <xavi_aracil_(1edtech)> @Ildiko is [0..1] | ||
| <dmitri_zagidulin> @Ildiko I'm not sure why that cardinality was | ||
| chosen. | ||
| <simone_ravaioli> Bestr.it in Italy has been issuing OB for | ||
| University Degrees for a while, but not sure they have the | ||
| additional "minor" details as a requirement. | ||
| <nate_otto_(he/him)> @Ildiko The cardinality of fieldOfStudy is | ||
| [0..1] just for historical reasons, that's what it was drafted | ||
| as, and multiple-field-of-study use cases weren't considered | ||
| until after the spec was final. Multiple values will definitely | ||
| be considered for the next revision. | ||
| <dmitri_zagidulin> @Simone - oh, great to know! | ||
| <dmitri_zagidulin> @Nate - ah, makes sense, thanks. | ||
| https://credreg.net/ctdl/terms/ | ||
| <federico_giacanelli> Hi Simone, Bestr.it is currently issuing | ||
| "minor" degree OBs but without any specific property. Just a | ||
| mention in the title | ||
| <ildiko_mazar> Thank you both @Xavi and @Nate. FYI (you probably | ||
| know already), in ELM it's card [0..*] | ||
| <nate_otto_(he/him)> Why is major just a string not a | ||
| multi-string value? | ||
| <nate_otto_(he/him)> I had two majors and two minors | ||
| Kerri Lemoie: :+1: | ||
| <phil_barker> @Nate Otto, in CTDL it would be multivalue with | ||
| Credential Alignment Objects as values. | ||
| <nate_otto_(he/him)> Right, Phil, my question is about the schema | ||
| on screen now, to represent double major | ||
| <dmitri_zagidulin> @Nate - I think this is a sample schema that | ||
| shows how to do either | ||
| <nate_otto_(he/him)> Sure, just do consider that use case before | ||
| you finalize v0.0.1, it's real! | ||
| <dmitri_zagidulin> totally agreed | ||
| <simone_ravaioli> here is a page of the University of Bergamo | ||
| with all the Badge classes for Diplomas | ||
| https://bestr.it/project/show/136 | ||
| <federico_giacanelli> Here's a OB set from University of Venice | ||
| Ca' Foscari titled "Minor" | ||
| https://bestr.it/project/show/117?ln=en | ||
| <kerri_lemoie> Would concentrations be included in a similar way? | ||
| Part of the same extensions? | ||
| <simone_ravaioli> thank Fede, much better ! | ||
| <federico_giacanelli> :+1: @simone | ||
| <kerri_lemoie> @federico, would minor be a separate badge from | ||
| the degree? | ||
| <federico_giacanelli> @kerri I'm not directly involved into it, | ||
| but AFAIK these are sort of mini-courses composed of a small | ||
| number of Degree exams: cfr https://bestr.it/badge/show/3618 | ||
| <phil_barker> Yes! in CTDL it is an object! | ||
| <federico_giacanelli> @kerri so yes they are separates from the | ||
| degrees: https://bestr.it/project/show/148 | ||
| <kerri_lemoie> Thanks @federico! | ||
| <kerri_lemoie> @philBarker - would you be able to show an | ||
| example? | ||
| <phil_barker> Not right now | ||
| <kerri_lemoie> :) | ||
| <deb_everhart_(credential_engine)> here are credentials in CTDL, | ||
| and you can filter to see specific types, e.g. degrees | ||
| https://credentialfinder.org/search?searchType=credential | ||
| <phil_barker> @Kerri but the value for degreeMajor etc. is a | ||
| Credential Alignment Object which looks like the | ||
| https://credreg.net/ctdl/terms/CredentialAlignmentObject and | ||
| which include links to the definition used for "Biology" etc. as | ||
| a Degree Concentration | ||
| Kerri Lemoie: :+1: | ||
| <nate_otto_(he/him)> @Phil if you had your preference between two | ||
| options, what would it be? (1) not use the CTDL and use some | ||
| other IRI instead, or (2) use the CTDL while not obeying the | ||
| expectations of the CTDL for the value? | ||
| <phil_barker> @Nate, I don't see why use CTDL as expected isn't | ||
| an option! | ||
| <nate_otto_(he/him)> Some implementers may feel that something | ||
| like "major": [{"targetNodeName": "Biology"}] is overwrought | ||
| <phil_barker> It would add about 6 characters to the JSON | ||
| <phil_barker> (if you alias the targetNodfName) | ||
| <nate_otto_(he/him)> Credential Engine recommends adding an | ||
| "alignment" to a target URL on credentialfinder.org . In | ||
| addition, the "ctid" property could be added to the Achievement | ||
| if the CTDL IRI for that term appears in the extension context. | ||
| https://credentialengine.org/resources/how-to-align-digital-credentials-with-meaningful-ctdl-data/ | ||
| <deb_everhart_(credential_engine)> here's the alignment guidance | ||
| for using a CTID for additional linked data within an OB3 | ||
| https://www.imsglobal.org/spec/ob/v3p0/impl/#alignment-with-a-ceterms-credential-resource | ||
| Kerri Lemoie: | ||
| https://docs.google.com/document/d/1T-_-w5N2Ax5kl6x5-TgbSd-9PaPI3q4J2mnsFHgnBV0/edit?tab=t.0#heading=h.hrcjoq4lis6w | ||
| <dmitri_zagidulin> example multi-language VC from the VC 2.0 | ||
| spec: | ||
| https://www.w3.org/TR/vc-data-model-2.0/#example-example-dual-language-credential | ||
| <ildiko_mazar> :-D | ||
| <ildiko_mazar> Yes, we can see | ||
| <ildiko_mazar> Would there be a semantic consideration to which | ||
| approach to apply? "related" feels not exactly the same as the | ||
| main achievement in a different language. | ||
| <deb_everhart_(credential_engine)> CTDL uses inLanguage | ||
| https://credreg.net/ctdl/terms/#inLanguage | ||
| <phil_barker> @Deb CTDL uses inLanguage for the language of the | ||
| credential, but uses standard rdf langStrings for the metadata | ||
| just like VCs | ||
| <deb_everhart_(credential_engine)> :+1: | ||
| <ildiko_mazar> We feel that with European Digital Credentials - | ||
| our multilingual creds are massive json files | ||
| Kerri Lemoie: :Slightly_smiling_face: | ||
| <ildiko_mazar> We do the "title" : { | ||
| <kayode_ezike> CLRv2 | ||
| <ildiko_mazar> We have QR codes for all EDCs - independent from | ||
| their size (I don't know how they are generated though) | ||
| <kerri_lemoie> Interesting @Ildiko - can the values for each | ||
| language be an array? | ||
| <ildiko_mazar> Yes, @Kerri | ||
| Kerri Lemoie: :+1: | ||
| <kerri_lemoie> Thank you!! | ||
| <kerri_lemoie> I could start a thread on vc-edu mailing list | ||
| about this. | ||
| <federico_giacanelli> bestr.it already exports some OBs in EDC | ||
| format (thanks to @ildiko help) | ||
| <ildiko_mazar> And size-wise, a transcript of records with 10 | ||
| subjects is 885KB | ||
| <dmitri_zagidulin> @Ildiko - yeah, and the QR code limit is ~4KB | ||
| <dmitri_zagidulin> so it's way over. | ||
| <ildiko_mazar> ...and that ToR is 8826 lines of code, by the way | ||
| <federico_giacanelli> :wave: |
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